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  Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll 
 
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Carter Sudeith Dec 28, 2004, 12:15pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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The thing I can't get over is the fact that 30,000 people got killed in a matter of hours, whereas 3,000 people got killed in a matter of hours on 9/11.

Let's declare a war on nature.


Also, I can't imagine what that would be like, the horror of watching your entire life's accomplishments come crashing down, and then have to choose between leaving your family behind and running for safety or staying with your family and being guaranteed to die. :(

I greatly appreciate the efforts of the rescue and cleanup crews, and can't comprehend the widespread killing of this horrific event.


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David Dec 28, 2004, 12:39pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
Its a realy tragedy, they were saying upto 57,000 may have been killed this morning. Is anyone else planning on giving to charity?, these people realy need help.

David.

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Dave McLain Dec 28, 2004, 02:18pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
From what I heard on NPR this morning some of the people who survived said it sounded like a big jet plane flying, incredibly loud and terrible. I'm not sure how anyone could have been warned in time to save them either....


Sean B Dec 28, 2004, 02:21pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
It's tragedies such as this that make you wonder how many people you're screwing over in the future by depleting the ozone layer and causing an accelerated global warming.



Carter Sudeith Dec 28, 2004, 02:24pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
It doesn't have a lot to do with the ozone layer. In fact, nothing to do with it.

Heh. We can't stop the earth from shifting any more than we can shoot the moon with a rubber-band gun. We just don't have the power...

Sean B Dec 28, 2004, 02:39pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
Gasp! A non-believer of the greenhouse effect.

What are you, a Mac user?

Steve Vickers Dec 28, 2004, 03:12pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
God...leave it to a tree hugger to want to change the subject with his ignorance. A Tsunami is the result of a earthquake which has nothing to do with this so called global warming. It is now reported that the a**hole countries of the world are saying how "stingy" we are when it comes to financial help, jeez we can never win for losing, and to concider these are the countries that are involved with the 22 BILLION dollar scandale with the worthless, useless, and totaly currupt U.N.....ya gotta wonder if what there motive is......

My condollences to all that lost life and I prey for a quick recovery

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Mike Casper Dec 28, 2004, 03:32pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
Dann, read the waves was speeding over 500 MHP. That is so f**king fast. Anyone know if that speed contiune onces the waves reach the shores? And at how many feet? Anyone know?

John Ingram Dec 28, 2004, 03:33pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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Edited: Dec 28, 2004, 03:35pm EST

 
>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
Total now at 80,000 with possibility of over 250,000 in total.

First multi-national disaster in living memory. I believe with various situations in the world, including global warming, there will be no more multi-national disasters that will not be within living memory.

Medicines and clean water. So Red Cross/Red Cresecent has been my choice of a donation.


Eric Schmidt Dec 28, 2004, 03:34pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
Words well said, Sander. Bless All with families that experienced this tragic event.

Jose Garcia Dec 28, 2004, 03:53pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
My prayers go out to all those people affected by this. All we can really do to help is to give, so give to a charity if you can.

Sean B Dec 28, 2004, 04:30pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
Steve, leave your right wing politics out of it and look at it in a broad sense.

I'm by no means a "tree hugger", but I think if you can put billions of dollars into going to war under false pretenses, there are definitely better(not to mention real) things that could've materialized from that money.

Instead of doing the old smash and grab, this country could've spent the past three years developing a hydrogen/solar/electric hybrid and rid the industry of most oil dependencies.

Deleted User Dec 28, 2004, 04:36pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
Its almost impossible ot have an early warning for Tsunamis since the speed at which they travel is too fast for effective evacuations to be held. Its also very hard to be able to see it from a great distance. The wave's energy is mainly submerged unlike a normal wave. When it gets shallow, the force of thousands of tons of fast moving water has to go somewhere.

bar fly Dec 28, 2004, 04:51pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
Many,many,many,many,many people need help OUR help NOW. Red Cross is good.

The Real Robert Jones Dec 28, 2004, 04:56pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
Ehh, it could be started by global warming. Who knows? I am not a tree lover/humper/activist, but I can tell you some really strange things have been going on lately. The river outside my home (which branchs from the Potomac River, a major river in VA), has gotten about 6 inches taller in 1-2 years. Just two weeks ago, South Texas (along the Gulf of Mexico) saw it's first white Christmas in 87 years with 14 inches of snow, and it's first accumalating snow in 15 years (and even 15 years ago they only got like 3 inches). In VA, we've been going up to 70 F one day, and one day later, we are down to 12 degrees F. Certainly, there has to be something going on with the climate, and all these examples are just a FEW of what I have seen in the past years. Incredibly hot summers, collosal totals of snow in winters, it's rediculous. Last year, VA got pounded with over 25 inches of snow, first time in over 14 years we've ever seen that much. Now, we see Tsunamis, which could be caused by higher pressure on thes**tfting land templates, due to deeper, colder waters (from the melting ice poles). Again, I'm not way the kind of guy who promotes electric cars, but these are just a few of my collections of evidence that show that something must be happening to the climate.

P.S. If you have seen Day After Tomorrow, it is very possible that something like that could happen. I did a research report a few months back wiith a scientist at NOAA, and he stated that "...something like the movie, Day After Tomorrow, is very possible, just not to the grand scale the that movie depicted it. But, a total climate change, or even an ice age, can happen as fast as 2 years..."

Food for thought.

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Brendan Falvey Dec 28, 2004, 05:03pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
Must put you right there Amara. There is a Tsunami warning system operating in the Pacific basin and the warning are coordinated via Hawaii. they have contacts in all countries likely to be affected by these freaks of nature. I saw a report where the centre stated that they knew what was happening before they struck but had no one to contact directly. Imagine the inertia of bureacracies that need legislation to act and unless there is a point of contact the mesage could take days to arrive. Another fact of life buerucracies anchor our societies in the present for better or worse. Unfortunately, bureacracies work in weeks not hours

While this is a tragedy hopefully the good will be that a global warning system will be established since no coastal region is immune from this type of disaster. In australia we are exposed to the east and west of our country. tidal surges were experienced in Western australia and the east is exposed to similar effects to the south and east. There was an 8.1 undersea quake in the last week or so southeast of australia near Macquarie Island. New Zealand has similar features able to create the disasters we are talking about. The Atlantic has a possible source of such events near either the Azores or canary Isands so those in the atlantic basin may not be immune

It should also remind us that an asteroid strike in one of the oceans would have a similar effect. What contingency planning have the western world governments made or is it all too hard. Probably save the bosses and the rest can stick our heads where the sun does not shine. While a bit of a tree hugger but to the right of politics I would agree that much government spending could be better directed. Global warning will eventually kill some people it will be the death of a thousand cuts rather than the cut from this sword of Damocles we have just seen

Sparton Dec 28, 2004, 05:06pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
Dann, read the waves was speeding over 500 MHP. That is so f**king fast. Anyone know if that speed contiune onces the waves reach the shores? And at how many feet? Anyone know?


To answer your question, while the wave is travelling across the ocean at 500 mph it is probally less than 10 feet high, but once it begins to reach the shallow coastal waters the wave will slow to roughly 45 mph and transfer that momentum into height and shoot up to over 60 feet high before it rolls over the land.

As the others, I send my deepest sympathies to anyone feeling the pain of the tragedy.

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John Warner Dec 28, 2004, 05:29pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
what annoys me, is where (potentially indirectly, but definately influenced) america declared war on Iraq after 911, in which it spent 50 Billion (of which only 2 billion was aid), nothing like that will be pledged towards this much more worthy cause... I think it just shows how poor allocation of finance worldwide is at this moment in time.

The Real Robert Jones Dec 28, 2004, 08:00pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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Edited: Dec 28, 2004, 08:10pm EST

 
>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
See, now you all are beginning to compare apples with oranges. Greenhouse effect can be prevented. Asteroids and earthquakes cannot. What do you people want the government to do with the money 'they are using inefficiently'? Yeah a global warning system would be nice, but it really streches the governments abilities. So you want the government to make an asteroid barrier?? That's not going to happen in a while either. Terrorists CAN be prevented. Tsunamis are an act of God (no offense to Atheists). The reason the US government spends money on terrorism is that is can be prevented, it is man-made, not by Mother Nature. And yes, the US governement is donating over 20 million dollars to the rescue ade. May not sound like a lot, but it's not even in our territory! Did any other countries help us in Iraq? Yeah, we got the British, and they're hiding in trees (no offense again, but honestly). No one has helped us out, so we are already pushing it. You pat my back, I pat yours. This is what it's all about.

As for the greenhouse effect, I am not a nature guy, but honestly, people these days are abusing nature. Yeah, right now the greenhouse effect isn't doing jack to our world. But, in 20 years or even less, something is going to happen. If the polar ice caps do melt, we are screwed, and apparently you people have no clue what's going on. Polar ice caps melting will result in overall colder oceans, which will disrupt the whole flow of the ocean's currents, which can cause major, major disaster. Problem with people these days is they let things happen before prevent it from happening. And when we get another ice age (in which we are coinncidentally very close to in the 10,000 year record of ice age records), I think our attitudes towards the greenhouse effect will be quite different. Again, I'm not a nature guy, but I have reasons to believe this.

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Steve Gaskin Dec 28, 2004, 08:51pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
I too was shocked to hear of the scale of the disaster, and the power of the event. I cannot imagine the suffering that it will cause.

I think it naive though to blame global warming for earthquakes. They have been a part of history for thousands of years - long before industrialisation, and the associated pollution of our environment.

But - I am a Christian and fully believe in the prophecies of the Bible. If it is correct, there will be many more disasters on this scale in the sometime future. If you trust only in the planet for your future I can see how there would be a tendency to be majorly concerned about greenhouse gases and the like - but if the Bible is correct, that should be the least of your concerns - if you are not right with God.

See this for what it is - a warning. Turn to God through Jesus Christ while you have time.

Wolfen Dec 28, 2004, 08:52pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: The frailty of human life, when nature takes its toll
1st: Let us all take a moment and feel for the people that have been lost, and that are still left and looking for the lost. Their pain is real.

2nd: Because feelings do absolutely NOTHING, now give the Red Cross, or some other aid agency or church helping that area of the world. Doing something is better than watching 24x7 news coverage that is just morbid after a while.

3rd: Politics and the weather ... grow up people a single heavy volcanic eruption will put out more "chemicals" of a green house nature than all of the chemicals man has ever put into the atmosphere for all time. Yes we need to keep an eye on things, but to think we are having an affect on nature in such a massive way is just under-educated BS of an extremely egotistical nature is all. (( My dad is one of those PhD’s Meteorologist that works with data that is not in the noise area to do research and not one fighting for money from Congress by pushing something that is 99.9% chance garbage! )) Look at the LONG-term trends and you will find that we are in a cool time and a REALLY stable time in the earth’s atmosphere and sun interaction. Remember that 100 years to the earth is NOTHING. Yes, we can denude the land and change the weather that way and with today’s technology that IS possible, so worry about things of that nature please. OH, before I forget, … I LOVE nature and climbing, hiking, and all that, but I keep perspective too!

4th: To compare human awfulness (terrorism ... 9/11) with nature unleashing on us is just stupid too. We can affect change with terrorists. Put a gun to their head and wa-la, no more terrorists. With nature we can just react to its might. I have OVER simplified on purpose, for fun, but we can affect our human condition and should, and helping large numbers of people learn what freedom of choice is a wonderful and expensive thing to do. Freedom is not free, and not cheap! But it is well worth the price. Living in the USA proves that!

The end.


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