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John Ingram Oct 09, 2006, 06:08pm EDT Report Abuse
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Wayne Peterson Oct 10, 2006, 03:30pm EDT Report Abuse
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Personally, I'm sick of paying good money for my software, following the terms of the license, and still being treated like I'm doing something wrong.


I usually do a reinstall of Windows about every 9 months or so. I did one last month and when the activate windows screen came up I told it to go ahead and activate. Well I get the message that it can't activate me over the internet and I will have to call. So I make the call (get a busy signal the first five times), then I have to wait on hold for about 45 minutes. When I finally get a person, they tell me I have installed too many times and they aren't going to let me reactivate. After 3 hours of arguing with different people, they threatened to sue me for piracy (and this was after I had faxed them a copy of my receipt. I never throw them away). So now I have a copy of Windows XP that I paid for that I can no longer legally use, just because MS feels like it.

Luckly I had a laptop that I had converted to Linux and just used the XP product key that came with it. I would switch my desktop to Linux but I'm a gamer and unfortunatly there just are not that many native Linux game releases. So I'm stuck with MS for now. But I will hold off on buying Vista as long as I can. Maybe by then I won't need to.

john albrich Oct 12, 2006, 08:10pm EDT Report Abuse
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By Peter Lambert Oct 05, 2006, 01:15 PM
OK, so taking this latest "innovation" from Mr Gates' gang, if Ford or GM adopt the same policy does that mean my car would crash, the wheels fall off, or something equally drastic if I did not get it serviced by one of their garages within 30 days of the due date?


It would also mean that your airbags (security) will no longer deploy, your keys (OS) might no longer work, and if you install a new fuel-efficient engine (CPU) you may have to get new keys (note that new "smart" car keys can cost > US$150 per key)

john albrich Oct 12, 2006, 09:37pm EDT Report Abuse
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Some comments regarding software licenses and EULAs, because people seem to think there's one OEM EULA and one generic EULA.

There isn't.

You can't "Google-up" THE EULA for a specific installation. The online EULA copies are templates...they are not necessarily identical to EULAs actually imposed.

The EULA can be different for every situation. There is no one single EULA that covers every install. The XP (Retail) EULA isn't identical to the XP OEM EULA. The XPpro Retail EULA from 3 months ago may not be the same as the XPpro Retail EULA for a package bought today.


EXAMPLES OF SIGNIFICANT EULA DIFFERENCES:


EXAMPLE 1: DEVICE CONNECTIONS ( I bet this one shocks some people) :

XPhome RETAIL: This is from a specific XPhome (Retail) EULA:

1.3 Device Connections. You may permit a maximum of five (5) computers or other
electronic devices (each a "Device" ) to connect to the Workstation Computer to utilize one or more of the following services of the Software: File Services, Print Services, Internet Information Services, and remote access (including connection sharing and telephony services)


XPpro OEM: Same item from EULA for the XPpro OEM computer I'm using right now:

1.4 Device Connections. You may permit a maximum of ten (10) computers or other
electronic devices (each a "Device" ) to connect to the COMPUTER to utilize one or more of the following services of the SOFTWARE:File Services, Print Services, Internet Information Services, Internet Connection Sharing and telephony services.


EXAMPLE 2: TRANSFER TO A DIFFERENT COMPUTER

XPhome RETAIL:

1.1 Installation and use. You may install, use, access, display and run one copy of the Software on a single computer, such as a workstation, terminal or other device ("Workstation Computer" ) The Software may not be used by more than one processor at any one time on ANY single Workstation Computer.

XPpro OEM:

1.2 SOFTWARE as a Component of the COMPUTER - Transfer.
This license may not be shared, transferred to or used concurrently on different computers. The SOFTWARE is licensed with the COMPUTER as a single integrated product and may only be used with the COMPUTER.If the SOFTWARE is not accompanied by HARDWARE, you may not use the SOFTWARE. You may permanently transfer all of your rights under this EULA only as part of a permanent sale or transfer of the COMPUTER,

This OEM EULA clearly shows the software is NOT transferable to any other computer, EVEN IF it is the only copy used and the original computer is destroyed..

There is a further distinction between the "Academic Editions" of the EULAs. For example: Under the Academic Edition EULA, once you are no longer a student/teacher/etc you MUST buy another license to continue using that copy of Windowx.


EXAMPLE 3: LIMIT ON NUMBER OF PROCESSORS (this one may shock you too)

XPhome RETAIL
1.1 Installation and use. You may install, use, access, display and run one copy of the Software on a single computer, such as a workstation, terminal or other device ("Workstation Computer" ) The Software MAY NOT BE USED BY MORE THAN ONE PROCESSOR AT ANY ONE TIME on any single Workstation Computer.

XPpro OEM
1.1 Installation and use. You may install, use, access,display and run one copy of the SOFTWARE on the COMPUTER.The SOFTWARE MAY NOT BE USED BY MORE THAN TWO (2) PROCESSORS AT ANY ONE TIME ON THE COMPUTER, unless a higher number is indicated on the COA.

Both these 1.1 articles clearly state that even if the software/OS supports multiple processors, you are limited by the respective EULA. I SUSPECT that Microsoft probably considers a "CORE" the same as a "PROCESSOR". So, there may be legal problems with using multi-core processors in your system. Dual-cores for XPhome Retail may not be allowed, and more than Dual-core may not be allowed for this XPpro OEM. But, I may be wrong. This will need to be addressed by Microsoft, but it is up to the END USER to make sure he/she is in compliance with the EULAs.



There is no one single OEM EULA, etc. It varies from vendor to vendor depending on its contracts with Microsoft. There are corporate licenses, government licenses, Retail licenses,and more...and there are multiple versions of each. Plus, as seen above, the COA (Certificate Of Authenticity) can modify the EULA. And, as Brian Pope noted, some terms in a EULA may be rendered unenforceable depending on the country. EULAs are also affected at the state/province level.

Statutory laws and regulations are considered superior to contracts, licenses, etc.

To be certain of the current terms of YOUR license(s) ... you must read YOUR particular documents and inquire with Microsoft as to any modifications since your purchase. You should also know that Windows components such as Internet Explorer, Network Services, Outlook Express, etc. have their OWN EULAs.


edited to remove auto-smilies
edited to add EXAMPLE 3 LIMIT ON NUMBER OF PROCESSORS

john albrich Oct 14, 2006, 10:43pm EDT Report Abuse
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For some info on Vista license concerns, See Payton's thread at

http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/62662

Gord Horton Nov 02, 2006, 10:46am EST Report Abuse
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John,
I quite agree with most of what you say. Xp has everything most people need. I was merely pointing out the fact that eventually the market will get flooded with Vista. Not necessarily in the next 12-18 months, but "eventually"( depending on sales if you want to use that as a measure). Microsoft can put anything in their software they want and sooner or later it will become the standard. One day they will stop the support for XP and force everyone to change.
Not a truer statement is made when you say there is no reason to switch to Vista except for gaming. The change may be slow especially if microsoft thinks that gaming features will do the trick. Cost is not the only factor here. My kids (12 & 13) both have computers but they and all their friends don't play games on computers. It is Xboxes, Ps2's and the like that they use for gaming. The new trend for our next generation of consumers?

Gord Horton Nov 02, 2006, 10:57am EST Report Abuse
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Cancel my last comment as it was already posted. This is what happens when you log on with a form fill program you try to save with the logon info but forget to delete the text. OOPS

John Ingram Nov 02, 2006, 03:26pm EST Report Abuse
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Gord Horton said:
Cancel my last comment as it was already posted. This is what happens when you log on with a form fill program you try to save with the logon info but forget to delete the text. OOPS


Hey, technology and software are a bummer, because the humans who write the software have no real life input. Hence, ever look down a list of anything on a website and then wanted to go to page 2 only to find the page numbers/next/last are at the TOP of the list, so you have to scroll up, or if your so inclined, click on 'top' and then scroll down instead.

And I and you could give a million other ways you can tell that regular people are not involved. Hence, technology turn off in so many ways currently,

Adriano Soares Nov 13, 2006, 05:05pm EST Report Abuse
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After all that propaganda about security against pyrate copies, the pyrates will be extremely happy to see fake copies recognised as legitimate :D


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