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  Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks? 
 
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Trent Creekmore Feb 13, 2007, 09:57am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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I think part of the issue could be with more 64 bit processors which Vista now has code for.

I made my computer dual boot with XP and XP 64bit when I noticed all the 32 bits games played with significant performance problems. Same thing happened when Windows 95 came out which was 32 bit and the 16bit games played incredibly slow also.



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John Ingram Feb 13, 2007, 10:58am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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Edited: Feb 13, 2007, 10:58am EST

 
>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
Same here. I dual booted with Win98se and XP when XP first came out and all games compatible ran better on Win98 than XP. As I have said elsewhere when XP games pretended they were so good they need 1GB of RAM, it was really XP demanding it, and now with Vista, watch how the game publishers will say their vista games will need 2GB because of all the great graphics, etc, when really it will be Vista needing it.

What I can see is a repeat of history, in the early 90's the CD drive came along and games publishers dropped floppy games almost straight away. Problem was nobody was will to buy a CD drive and upgrade, they all waited 18 months to get a new PC. In that 18months PC gaming nearly died. It survived because a much higher percentage of PC gamers were hardcore and so upgraded and helped PC gaming survive.

Today we have very many fewer hardcore PC gamers. Most home PC owners are going to wait at least a year to get VIsta and if they wait until they get a new PC with it pre-installed it could be two. And I see publishers producing Vista/DX10 games well before then and seeing sales disappear in an even more extravagated form of 'my PC won't run that'.

I don't think we should see Vista only games until the middle of 2008, but the way the PC games business works, they're not going to wait and I think they're going to get more than their fingers burnt!

dark41 Feb 13, 2007, 11:10am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
You're both missing the point that some of the most popular games on the planet don't play at all on Vista.

Of the ones that do, both NFS Carbon and Most Wanted are terribly choppy with 2 gigs of PC2-800 RAM and a E6400 CPU. Madden 07 locks up when kicking field goals or extra points. V8 Supercars 3 locks up on the first corner. The list goes on and on.

No, this is more than a memory issue. Vista is a bloated OS that sucks for gaming. I feel sorry for the poor souls who buy it for directx 10. I think they'll be sorely disappointed.

EX38-DS5
E8500@4.0GHz (445x9, 1.40v) TRUE Black
Corsair HX620W
2x2gb Kingston HyperX 9600
HIS IceQ4 HD4850
2X1TB F1s (RAID 0) XP Pro/Win7 Ult 64
Auzen X-Fi Prelude 7.1
Cambridge Soundworks 500w 5.1
G5, Antec 1200
justin marley Feb 13, 2007, 12:59pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
I have been using Vista Home Premium since launch and have run, GT Legends, GTR2, Rainbow Six Vegas, Dark Messiah and FSX with not performance hits. I have had trouble launching GTR2 and GT legends. They will run after install but after a while they stop working. Seems to be a registry issue, not sure. Anyway, those are the only two that are questionable. Others work fine.

Trent Creekmore Feb 13, 2007, 01:58pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
I think most of these game makers should take a look at Valve (make of Half Life) has been doing . They created "Steam" which is a online based playing/updating software.
Once you use this you no longer need your CDs with a steam account.
New computer? No problem just install Steam and all your games are downloaded and reinstalled.

It also acts as an udate mechanism. All of Steam games work on newest computer hardware/ Windows. Even the old orignal half-life has been updated from working on Windows 98 to now working fine on XP x64 edition which I have.
They even updated their newest games Half-Life 2 and recompiled to take advantage of 64 bit code.

A lot of game companies are not juming onboard to Steam with easy to purchase and make updates/patches to their games via Steam.


B Feb 13, 2007, 03:07pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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Edited: Feb 13, 2007, 03:12pm EST

 
>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
I'm holding off Vista until:
- More DX 10 games are available
- Second generation DX 10 graphics cards are released
- Driver support improves
- I build a new computer

I don't see the need to go from XP too Vista right now. It has no significant benefits over XP that appeal to me at the moment. Not having games that I enjoy such as HL2 and Counter-strike only makes matters worse.

steve large Feb 14, 2007, 08:41pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
Having run dual boot vista and xp, time and time again i go back to loading xp.
everyone seems to be raving about DX10 and I've only seen about 3 titles which are made using DX10.
Vista is a resource hog thats fact, but most new system builds are using 2 gig ddr2 ram which is plenty.
when XP was first released people moaned about drivers it took more resources than win 2000 etc etc.
it will take time to get vista to run as sweet as XP due to the fact that XP has had 5 years to get it running correct.
So folks all we can do is give it time.

Antec P180 case
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steve bourque May 30, 2007, 09:11pm EDT Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
wow yeh im really hurting on this issue. vanguard lock, silent hjunter 4 locks, eq2 locks.....virtually all my games lock running vista and this was a custom build from dell! rig consists of Dell xps 410, core 2 duo e6600 @2.4ghz, nvidia geforce8600gts 256, 2gb 667mhz ddr2 ram. i really think its just a compatibility issue between vista and pre vista games. hopefully either well get a windows update to help with compatibility or games will patch as necessary. i know whoever is going through this must feel my pain as gaming is a big part of my life and i feel as iv been robbed:/

TamTheBam May 30, 2007, 09:24pm EDT Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
All my games are now running sweet:

BF 2142
CoD 2
Condemned
DiRT Demo
F.E.A.R.
F.E.A.R. XP
Far Cry
NFS Carbon
NFS Most Wanted (frame rate slows a bit here and there)
QUAKE 4
Serious Sam II
STALKER
All games on STEAM
Test Drive ULT
TR Legend
TR Anniversary Demo

This's what I've installed at moment, and no probs!

....I'm back, but only as a part-timer... :)
CrAsHnBuRnXp May 30, 2007, 10:44pm EDT Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
Tam-the-Bam said:
All my games are now running sweet:

BF 2142
CoD 2
Condemned
DiRT Demo
F.E.A.R.
F.E.A.R. XP
Far Cry
NFS Carbon
NFS Most Wanted (frame rate slows a bit here and there)
QUAKE 4
Serious Sam II
STALKER
All games on STEAM
Test Drive ULT
TR Legend
TR Anniversary Demo

This's what I've installed at moment, and no probs!

http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/65355/

Way ahead of ya. :)

dark41 May 31, 2007, 12:22am EDT Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
Tam-the-Bam said:
All my games are now running sweet:


NFS Most Wanted (frame rate slows a bit here and there)


I wouldn't call slow frame rates sweet or no probs. Makes NFS unplayable at high difficulty.

I'd sure like to know how you got any NFS games to play on Vista. I've got NFSU, NFSU-2, NFSMW, NFSC. Every one of them freezes after a few seconds into the game. Every one. In fact, every EA Sports game does the same thing.

I have the latest drivers for MB and vid card. I haven't seen any patches for EA Games/Sports for Vista either.

EX38-DS5
E8500@4.0GHz (445x9, 1.40v) TRUE Black
Corsair HX620W
2x2gb Kingston HyperX 9600
HIS IceQ4 HD4850
2X1TB F1s (RAID 0) XP Pro/Win7 Ult 64
Auzen X-Fi Prelude 7.1
Cambridge Soundworks 500w 5.1
G5, Antec 1200
John Ingram May 31, 2007, 02:43am EDT Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
I think people are taking the 'me me me' situation instead of looking at the big picture. PC gaming is not so strong that it can have even more mainstream/softcore PC gamers leaving the hobby because of the hardware/OS demands of new PC games! If 5 or 6 AAA PC titles released over the next year or so lose money because so many non hardcore PC gamers (like me) have not upgraded or bought a new PC and still have their 1gb XP machine, you will see even fewer PC games released (last year had the lowest number of PC game releases ever) and by default PC gaming as we know it will come to an end, with just Steam, WoW, The Sims and small independent publishers with small downloadable games becoming the norm, if not all that's left in PC gaming, this along with retro and other retro machine emulation gaming! (two of the fastest growing niches already - a sure sign of change!).

The next 12 months or so are the most important in PC gaming. If AAA titles this Xmas require a 2.0ghz 1gb ram XP system, I will have hope, if they need DX10, Vista and 2gb ram, I am very pessimistic.

dark41 May 31, 2007, 03:35am EDT Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
That's a good point, as I sure won't be building 2 new systems for my kids to use for new games. I just broke down in June of last year and bought a 7600GS for my son's AGP system. I see no need to upgrade those systems as they work fine for everything else.

EX38-DS5
E8500@4.0GHz (445x9, 1.40v) TRUE Black
Corsair HX620W
2x2gb Kingston HyperX 9600
HIS IceQ4 HD4850
2X1TB F1s (RAID 0) XP Pro/Win7 Ult 64
Auzen X-Fi Prelude 7.1
Cambridge Soundworks 500w 5.1
G5, Antec 1200
dark41 May 31, 2007, 04:04am EDT Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
Then again, maybe game manufacturers will follow Microsoft's lead and create the games first, and service packs later on that actually make them playable on most machines. :)

http://australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,21793697-15308,00.html

EX38-DS5
E8500@4.0GHz (445x9, 1.40v) TRUE Black
Corsair HX620W
2x2gb Kingston HyperX 9600
HIS IceQ4 HD4850
2X1TB F1s (RAID 0) XP Pro/Win7 Ult 64
Auzen X-Fi Prelude 7.1
Cambridge Soundworks 500w 5.1
G5, Antec 1200
Dublin_Gunner May 31, 2007, 06:11am EDT Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
To be honest John, I think it is a very pessimistic view, but an unlikely one.


Game developers and publishers release games for 1 reason, and 1 reason only - to make money.

To think they would purposely exclude the majority of gamers it quite simply ludicrous.

Sure, a lot of new engines may be DX10 compliant, but they are backwards scalable.

Just because you cant put all details to max on an older machine doesnt mean you cant run the game!

Lancool PC K62
Phenom II x3 @ 3.5Ghz
4GB DDR2-800
ASUS GTX570 DirectCU II
John Ingram May 31, 2007, 01:02pm EDT Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: Windows Vista gaming, shooting blanks?
DublinGunner - Last year had the fewest PC game releases. Gamespot showed that between October and December (the Xmas selling season) what was released on PC averaged a Gamespot score of 57%, and finally retro gaming growth is enormous, as was the reporting given over to independent game publishers due to the growth of interest in them. This all points to a fact that PC gaming is already changing because of 'expectations' of Vista' and other hardware upgrade requirements. PC gamers have already decided they are not going to play this upgrade game any more, hence home PC sales in the UK down 30%.last year on the year before.

So change is already happening, and in a big way. eBay has a retro gaming section open last year, the Wii, based around retro gaming and gameplay over graphics has taken off like wildfire, Microsoft and Sony are falling over themselves trying to pbe more backward compatible and all the machines have virtual gaming to play the real retro stuff. Of all the consoles, Sony's PS3 is the most technological and most expensive and is struggling because it is going against the trend. ALL gamers are now refusing to play these cookie cutter clone games that account for a higher and higher percentage of video game releases.

But at least the console games cover multiple genres for multiple markets. From Guitar Hero to Ico. What does PC have? Sci-Fi FPS's, Fantasy AD&D RPG Fps and ever more frantic RTS's. For the mainstream it only has The Sims and it doesn't do much that is 'out of the box' ny more. Only console games do that.

So the revolution is already happening. In so many way gamers are turning their back on modern gaming and having more and more interest in older back catalogue that is easier and easier to play on modern machines (how much has DOSBox changed retro gaming in the last 18 months, for example?!)

Just because no body want to admit the trends are there, or refuse to report on them when they know they are does not mean they don't exist. The above trends are obvious for everybody to see. Unless you think it just co-incidence.


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