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  Re: How to kill your PC, quickly 
 
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dark41 Nov 08, 2007, 04:43pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
Actually, vacuuming tends to throw a fair amount of dust in the air by itself even with advanced vacuum cleaner filtration systems. My step son is anally obsessive about vacuuming. Does it every day (no exaggeration and trust me that I wish it was) whether the carpets need it or not. Our computers can go the 6 weeks he's at his father's house on holidays easily without being blown out and having the filters cleaned, but need weekly inspections the rest of the year. Our carpets don't seem to last very long either, go figure.

GtoX,
You've answered your own question about cigarette smoke. That tar/slime you pulled off your friend's computer also acts like glue on moving parts, including computer fans. Eventually it'll prevent them from starting with the system. So yes, smoking can/does harm computers.

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ultma 076 Nov 08, 2007, 07:51pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
the resin from different types of smoke can be a cocktail of chemicals, can corrode parts weaken bonds and can even become electricly conductive if it picks up the right particles,

boyah anyone.

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B Nov 08, 2007, 08:43pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
Sander Sassen said:
Brendan Gonsalves said:
Dust build up doesn't kill a PC quickly. It takes at least a year or two before the a significant amount of dust builds up which is capable of calling malfunction.


I'm going to respectfully disagree, the PC pictured in the column had been running for just six months, it all depends on how 'dusty' the environment is it is used in. In this particular case it was standing on the carpet in a teenager's bedroom, I guess he didn't vacuum often by the looks of it.

Best regards,

That is true. I was just considering my environment.

Bitmap Nov 08, 2007, 09:10pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
My environment for my PCs is pretty clean. I'm in my own room, I keep it clean (for the most part, but every now and then, the parents complain :P) and our cat and dog never set a paw in there. My dad's computer, however, is in the living room. The pets spend 80% of their day lounging in there, so on a whim, the other day, while my dad was out, I popped the side panel of his case, and lo and behold, there was a considerable amount of dust buildup. It was higher than mine, anyway, and my dad and I got our computers at the same time.

No one in the house smokes, though, I'm thankful for that, both for the sake of my PC, and the sake of my lungs.

________
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Rory Witham Nov 08, 2007, 10:09pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
Ahh thats what the mean when they say smoking kills.. there must not be enought room on the box to fit ... computers systems hardware or if dropped causing a house fire...

I mean, where at the pumping station/fuel/gas station does it say petrol fuels (unburnt) can cause cancer and are 50 times more toxic than cigerettes../

No Smart asnswrrs like its rwrote on the atoms of the fuel...


There are several types of dust and there are only a few of them that can cause more damage than other types of dust.. Wow great chat this is.. DUST.. DUST How many calories.. DUST DUST...

(you will need to watch little britain to know what Im on about)


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Gerritt Nov 09, 2007, 12:31am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
As most of you know by now, I'm so old school as to be Jurasic.
Most of the time I smoke is when I'm on my computer, and I am on my computer ALOT.
The tar does cause a stickiness that otherwise would not be there, but in my environment, I've never had a component fail because of a fan stopped due to dust (though several of my non-smoking customers have).
I recall a time when I was doing component level replacement on PC/AT Motherboards when I'd have to peel back a layer .25-.5" thick, just like you might find in your clothes dryer if you let it go a while, just to get to the ICs.

My work area is NOT clean (I'm a bit of a slob), and I have a shedding dog, a pain but I love him, and I've not yet had a fan or heat sink clog up. Why? Pantyhose. I put pantyhose around all of my fan driven intakes, and clean or replace as necessary. Doesn't look great at a lan party or in online pic-post, but it works great. Cost me about 1$/system/year and cleaning takes about 2 minutes (the old clothes dryer scenerio) for all of my systems, every month.

Don't get me wrong! SMOKING ANYTHING IS BAD FOR YOUR HEALTH, and for your system, but whatever you smoke; it is not as damaging to your system as not having the proper safeguards in place, or surfing porn (unprotected, and even if protected you need to get tested periodically, just like in real life), or peer to peer WAREZ.

Gerritt

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We all know what we know, and everyone else knows we are wrong.
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CrAsHnBuRnXp Nov 09, 2007, 12:59am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
My room is always a mess and when I had my Sunbeam Transformer case, my comptuer would get kinda dusty. Id clean it out whenever I thought about it and I had the time to do it. However, now that I have my Thermaltake Armor, all the intake fans are in the front of the case which also has a mesh covering making it an external fan filter. I have dust on the front of my PC as I type this, but not a OUNCE of it winds up inside my computer. Since I built it back in February with both my Opty and my current Q6600, I have not had to clean it on the inside once due to dust.

Gotta love the fan filters. :)

My computer teacher always used to bring in PC's for me to work on that were actually her customer's machine when she didnt have the time in the day to work on them. I was her assistant not only during my two hour classes with her, but also during another hour of the day. She brought in a computer one day that was so loaded with dust that you could pretty much just peel it out. It was insane. I dont know how the computer didnt die from overheating. If only I had a camera on me at the time.

dark41 Nov 09, 2007, 06:23am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
The fans that have stopped the most for me and my customers are the video card fans (especially the small ones on low end cards) and the ones on chipsets (also small fans). Usually those fans start to make an aweful racket before going, but not always. I've seen those fans go with tar and very little dust, and with no tar and heaps of dust.

I haven't seen a CPU fan stop yet, but I have seen the cooling fins so packed full of dust that the CPU has overheated and blown. Now adays, we set thermal control on the motherboard to shut down at 75C, and haven't had a blown CPU since doing so. But that wasn't always an option on older systems. :)

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dark41 Nov 09, 2007, 06:29am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
For what it's worth, I now use a thermaltake Kandalf which also has the filters on front. But I still have to clean it every other month or so as dust accumulates. The wife is using my old Lian Li PC65 which also has filters on front and also needs to be cleaned every other month or so. Same case for our server, and same situation. All 3 of these systems sit on the floor. The kids' use a generic case with no filters, but it sits inside a cabinet. That one never needs to be cleaned. The rest of ours are off the floor but out in the open and stay fairly clean as well.

Bottom line is there's a lot to be said for keeping your system off the floor, if you can stand the noise and have room. I don't. :)

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Michel Merlin Nov 09, 2007, 07:51am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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Edited: Nov 10, 2007, 02:58am EST

 
>> PCs need LSBB fans (Low Speed, Ball Bearing)
dark41 said:
The fans that have stopped the most for me and my customers are the video card fans (especially the small ones on low end cards) and the ones on chipsets (also small fans). Usually those fans start to make an aweful racket before going, but not always.

I confirm. I always silenced all the PCs I installed. In ~1995 this required a lot of work because nothing existed for it. On forums, speaking of silence was just drawing laughs and sarcasms. So I mail-ordered the only parts available from electronics shops in US or DE (fans, heatsinks, thermoregulators, cables, connectors) and made the rest of the work. Later when the need for silence started to be recognized I posted many times my request for what I called "LSBB" (Low Speed, Ball Bearing) fans, explaining why (In addition of engineer, I have been fluid mechanics professor in university).

Now the situation has vastly improved; low speed, large flow, hence high volume fans, are widely understood and accepted. Ball Bearing have been chosen by makers in many fans so the market tends to forget this aspect. So I recall:

- SB (Sleeve Bearing) is the most frequent because inexpensive and rather silent and effective... for a time; after some time (very variable) it will get worn and get friction, which will generate unpleasant noise - and possibly heat or other failures. SB is a good solution for a fan that works just occasionally, e.g. in a HD rack where you insert only secondary HDs, or even in CPU heatsink if its control makes it work not too long; in such cases the fan will reach its end of use (out of obsolescence) before its end of life.
- BB (Ball bearing) is the only long term heavy duty good quality solution really available in the real world. Don't trust all the ersatz (vapor-bearing, magnetic bearing and such), these are respectable tries, but none succeeded so far. A BB fan is almost as silent as a new SB fan, but will remain so for years of 24/24 work.
- SB small fans (e.g. 404010mm) are IMO appropriate as initial mount in HD racks, but unfortunately also chosen as initial mount in graphic cards or chipset heatsinks, inappropriately IMO since those are mostly used 24/24 or nearly.

Versailles, Fri 9 Nov 2007 13:51:15 +0100, edited (restored missing "SB" in last ) Sat 10 Nov 08:59 +0100

Afrow UK Nov 09, 2007, 08:01am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
It's amazing how effective a basic piece of gauze over the fans can reduce dust inside. My older machine has no basic filters and every time I open it up for cleaning, the bottom of the case itself has a nice thick layer of dust. The gauze mat on my newer machine picks up loads of strange stuff.

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Music: House, Dubstep, D&B, Trance, Metal
Jules Nov 09, 2007, 10:55am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
Hey - what a good discussion topic Sander.
And some excellent suggestions as to how to solve dust problems. I liked the one with old pantyhose over the air intakes.
When folk talk about 'filters' what do they mean? Is it some sort of Gauze over the air intakes?
Some of the cases that we are selling at the moment have 'gauze' for the front panel. Looks good, and will certainly help air flow, but dear - dust will surely accumulate.
I always strongly suggest to my customers that they put their tower up on the desk. If there is no room, or they don't like that idea I get them to lift the case off the carpet/floor by putting it on a small table/pile of books beside the desk. I am seriously thinking of having a small table made that I could sell - something that would lift the case off the floor by about 8 inches or so.
I go to a few pannel beaters/machine shops and bakery's, and I have made them construct an 'office' room with an air conditioner in it that creates positive pressure to try and keep the dust out of the room. And yes - I arrange to 'clean' the inside of the case every 3 months or so, or point out that they need to do it. Flour from baking is worse than old paint dust etc. The flour dust can 'ignite' - and that IS spectacular!
When taking a computer away to the workshop for repairs, after I have removed the tower I gently say to the owner "Have you got a vacuum cleaner". "While I'm away it would be a good idea to thorougly clean around the back and the shelves of the computer desk".
Worst dust creaters in my experience are cats and dogs, carpet, and 'slobs'.
I have an old vacuum cleaner that is able to 'blow' (as well as suck) and I use it to blow dust out. I take both sides of the case off, and the front panel if there is one. I hold the fans still with my hand while blowing them. I use a clean new 2-3 inch wide paint brush to brush off the 'stuck on" dust, expecially around heatsinks and on top of pci cards - then give another blow out.
For some reason I have this feeling that its better to 'blow' dust than to 'suck' it.
What do others think?

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dark41 Nov 09, 2007, 05:47pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
I use an air compressor to blow out dust, but realize not everyone has one. I don't think sucking dust (er.. you know what I mean) is such a good idea as you never know just what may come loose. Making sure to hold the fan blades still is another very good point. We've always done that, but I forgot to mention it. :)

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CrAsHnBuRnXp Nov 10, 2007, 02:54am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
Every year or so, I take it outside and douse everything with a garden hose. :D

Then I wax the modem to make it go faster.

Bitmap Nov 10, 2007, 02:56am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
Really? I submerge mine in a vat of acid to destroy the dust.

Last time I did that, though, I wound up with FrankenServer.

Baaaaaad mojo. :P

________
"None of you understand. I'm not locked up in here with you. YOU'RE locked up in here with ME." - Walter Kovacs, A.K.A. Rorschach.
Gerritt Nov 10, 2007, 11:12pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
I can't understand how a system gets totally clogged or a fan gets totally clogged in less than a year.
Maybe it is because of of cheap components/fans.

I haven't added any fluid to my system in over 1.4 years.
I haven't added or removed any fans from my systems in over 7 years.

My liquid cooled system is non-conductive solution only.
My fans are ball-bearing and not sleave-bearing.

I do use filter material (pantyhose), I don't Jones for looking pretty, but my systems all work.

Gerritt

Ad Astra Per Aspera
(A rough road leads to the Stars)
We all know what we know, and everyone else knows we are wrong.
System Specifications in BIO
Unatommer Nov 15, 2007, 10:46am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
"does smoking harm a computer btw? passive that is, not actually blowing the smoke into the fans... some have said it doesnt, as long as the temps are all in order..."

I would say that it doesn't help! It does the same thing to the components as it does to your lungs....leaves a think sticky residue on the components. If there is smoke in the air, it will get into your computer then mix with dust and create a nasty layer on all the system boards.

I opened a case once from this guy that as hillbilly as can be... He must have rolled his own cigarettes or smoked pall malls or something because there was lost of loose tobacco sitting in the bottom on the case. There was enough in there that I could have scraped it all up and rolled it up and smoked it! GROSS.

I also had a client whose machine would randomly lock up (all the time). After doing hardware tests and software tests, I dared to take of the side of the case. this thing had ONE INCH THICK of dusk over EVERYTHING! Took it outside and cleaned it out with a dust off can (holding my breath while doing so) and the machine started working properly again.

______________
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Jordon Cai Feb 06, 2008, 09:17pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
Hey, can you send me a message telling me the tips that you tell people to keep thier computers from getting killed by dust. I have both a PC and a Laptop.
Thanks,
~Jordon~

CrAsHnBuRnXp Feb 06, 2008, 09:23pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly
Put dust filters on the fan to keep dust from getting in and spray the case out with compressed air (while the computer is off) every now and then.

TamTheBam Feb 10, 2008, 09:13am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Re: How to kill your PC, quickly

I wanted to kill my PC quickly a good few times... with a mallet!!! When things don't
run smoothly...... :P

....I'm back, but only as a part-timer... :)

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