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  Power Supply Issues? 
 
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Martin Clark Oct 07, 2011, 10:47am EDT Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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I am having issues with the following machine:

(Fujits Simenes) Scaleo L C 260 1 256MB VSM 40G DVD/CDRW XPHuk
CPU: Intel Celeron 2.6 Ghz 128K Cache
Ram: 2 Gigabyte
HD: 1 x 40 GB, 1 x 200 GB
2 x DVD RW
Motherboard@ ASUS-P4GE-FSC
Integrated Graphics
Integrated Sound

I don't know for sure, but I suspect the power supply needs replacing. BIOS hardware monitoring tells me the 12 Volt output is often in the red, going as low as 10.8V at times.

The machine (sometimes) boots up, and then suddenly switches itself off.

I tried disconnecting all USB devices, and one time,it stayed on all night in this state. With USB devices connected, it will switch off suddenly, much sooner.

The last time this happend, I suspected it was a driver problem, but eventually discovered the CPU fan was clogged with dirt. When I cleaned the fan, it operated normally for about 9 months to a year.

What was happening in this case was the machine was getting hotter and hotter until it hit a critical temperature in the CPU and then shut off.

I also fixed the drivers with a replacement driver CD from the maker, which made some slight difference in operation as at the time there was a graphics issue - the machine would only work in a very low resolution - something like 640 x 480 with EGA colour or something.

The drivers fixed this. I cleaned the fan again this time, and this time, there was no change. Which suprised me. As, I had noticed from temperature monitoring software that the operating temperature seemed to be creeping upwards. So, fan clogging may have been one of the issues.

The Motherboard handbook says that a power supply is required which is able to output 1A when the fan is not running. at 5 V?. This is BIOS settable, power being available to USB, even when machine and fan is in stand by. or switched off.

In terms of upgrades, the machines ram has been upgraded from 256 to 2 gigabyte, a USB card has been fitted and a floppy disk drive.

The machine has 2 front USB ports, which have NEVER been fully functional. Strangely enough, I seem to recall they worked with one pen drive but nothing else, which seems totally bonkers.

The actual power supply in the machine is this one:

Delta Electronics Inc

Model DPS-300MB Rev 0
Input 200-240V (I'm in the UK)
Output 12V 15A Max
12V 0.8A
3.3V 20A Max

Max - 300W +5V 30A
+5V 3.3V
5V 200W

Combine 3.3
5V
12V
290W

This power supply appears to be obsolete. I am unsure if this is a micro or standard ATX power suppy. I suspect it is a standard size, through the motherboard is a micro ATX.

I don't know off hand, the number of leads coming off this power supply, so I don't know if I have to worry about a replacement supply having enough leads or the correct voltages coming out of it.

I have done a small amount of upgrading/replacement stuff with the inside of PC's, but despite being a I.T graduate, this sort of thing is not exactly a speciality of mine. So, some advice would be appreciated.

This machine has been tempremental ever since I got hold of it about 3-4 years ago. It is not my only machine. But, it is a useful one, since my main hard drive and printer is connected to it.

Regards

Martin Clark


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Martin Clark Oct 27, 2011, 07:11pm EDT Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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Edited: Oct 27, 2011, 07:43pm EDT

 
>> Re: Power Supply Issues?
I have solved my own problem. I won a 300W ATX PSU off eBay and tentatively opened up the PC, and removed the existing PSU. The replacement power supply was a Casecom model, a maker I had not heard of before. I installed the replacement PSU. I had a bit of trouble making the HDD connectors reach as the cables barely long enough. When I booted up. The machine came to life, and appears to be stable, and fully functional. The front USB ports work too, which I have NEVER known to work before, which must indicate that the power supply unit must have ALWAYS been an issue. Something I noticed that one of the pins of the main motherboard connector from the old PSU was actually burnt black and partially broken or melted, which meant the new motherboard connector wouldn’t go in all the way. I wondered what was the cause of this black pin? Perhaps a short circuit?


One remaining problem is the occasional unable to read RAM error, which is worrying because the RAM was totally replaced a few years ago with brand new RAM.


I am surprised that no one has replied to this post, through so far over 200 people have viewed it, perhaps the problem was too much of a no brainer. However, it was just a guess that the problem was the PSU.


I should have gone for a more powerful PSU really, but there are no problems thus far apart from the new PSU being more noisy than the old one.

Martin Clark Nov 11, 2011, 07:55pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Power Supply Issues?
Perhaps I spoke too soon. There is something else happening now. The USB mouse goes dead after a period of time. And requires to be unplugged and re-plugged into the USB port. Last time I tried this, a blue flash came from the PSU and PC reset. Not sure if it's a problem with the mouse, PSU or PC yet.

john albrich Nov 11, 2011, 09:08pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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Edited: Nov 11, 2011, 09:27pm EST

 
>> Re: Power Supply Issues?
.
It's possible your thought was right about the basics being a possible reason for no response (e.g. one could search HWA for [system debug], [PSU problem], etc) but 200 views really isn't very many. Possibly your thread got quickly buried by a number of other posts that pushed it down the page and out of view/memory of folks. Example, we've had spammers that post maybe 15 threads in a row and it puts legitimate threads way down the page. Out of sight, out of mind.

Anyway, some basic GENERAL debugging is covered in threads pointed to in this post:
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/77789/#592604 While the procedures are generally more helpful for a solid failure, you may find them useful.

Also, make sure you have the computer set to NOT automatically reboot in the event of an error (e.g. a blue screen). It reads like you have it set in the non-debug mode. When you set it to NOT automatically reboot, when it hits a BSOD it will keep it on the screen for review. Also, you can use a utility like BluescreenView (http://majorgeeks.com/BlueScreenView_d6200.html) to help you analyze the contents of the BSOD and may ID the culprit.


edit to add:
By the way, I had an 6 year-old Microsoft "Intellimouse" USB 5V/100mA optical mouse with similar symptoms. It "turned-off" after X minutes when it was connected to any of the motherboard USB2 ports on several WinXP (SP2 or SP3) loaded computers, and I had to unplug/plug it back in to "reset" the mouse. But, it NEVER "turned off" when connected to a motherboard's USB3 port (also running WinXP SP3). I never tried it using a hub or on Win7 USB2 or USB3 (with or without any hubs). Results might have been different. Also, ALL in all cases, power savings management was disabled for the system and devices...so it wasn't due to the mouse being unable to awaken after being "put to sleep".

I also verified the mouse took just about exactly the specified 100mA...so it wasn't overloading the USB2 ports (should handle up to 500mA per port), and the failure occurred whether the Intellimouse driver was installed or not (e.g. using the default Windows mouse driver). So, I suspect my problem with that mouse was most likely an issue with the Windows XP USB2 drivers.

Martin Clark Nov 12, 2011, 04:02am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Power Supply Issues?
Things are more serious now. After the PC reset, it worked ok, I then shut it down when finished. And now, it's dead. The fuse in the plug hasn't blown. My gut feeling is the PSU has actually blown.

I had a USB card, which had a externally cased Laptop HDD which was drawing 1 Amp from 2 USB sockets. There was also a USB Wireless "Stick" plugged into this card.

The Motherboard USB, had the USB mouse in one socket. And in another socket, a USB hub which had a external HDD with it's own PSU, a external optical drive (own PSU) and a printer (also own PSU obviously).

Thanks for your reply. I did wonder if this site was actually dead, given the last articles appear to be dated 2009.

<a class= Nov 18, 2011, 04:37am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Power Supply Issues?
Yeah, not sure what Sander is up to nowdays..

_______________________________________________________
3930K @ 5.00Ghz | GA-X79-UD3P | 16Gb DDR3 | GTX770 | W7 x64
john albrich Nov 18, 2011, 04:35pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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Edited: Nov 18, 2011, 04:37pm EST

 
>> Re: Power Supply Issues?
.
Martin,

Apparently, I also missed your Nov 12th update when it came out.

Martin Clark said:
Things are more serious now. After the PC reset, it worked ok, I then shut it down when finished. And now, it's dead. The fuse in the plug hasn't blown. My gut feeling is the PSU has actually blown....


Something that can often save a lot of time and reduce the risk to hardware, is a low-cost go/no-go PSU tester. As said in other posts they are a crude test tool, but they are relatively inexpensive and can be very helpful. A go/no-go tester looks at only the most simple kinds of PSU failures (e.g. DC voltage wihin spec (and it has its own accuracy limitations), and generally doesn't show ALL problems that can cause operational problems or even damage to computer hardware (ripple, intermittent spikes, failure under full load, etc. But they can detect the more common PSU failures: generally either total absence of a voltage or a voltage that is below or above the specified value (see the voltage table at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATX#Power_supply)

If you decide to get one, either for now or the future, make sure it can handle all the connectors from your PSU. For example, some PSU testers cannot test the newer 8-pin PCI-e power connectors (example of this is the Ultra PSU tester at the TigerDirect link I've included below), and may not even test SATA power connectors. You'll sometimes find older PSU testers for the cheapest prices (although some companies rely on customer ignorance and STILL charge premium prices for old-spec testers that can't handle all the connector types on newer PSUs). Here's an EXAMPLE of the different PSU connectors. It may not be 100% up-to-date but I'm including it as it's easy to see some of the differences that may not be so obvious to people new to hardware details at this level. http://www.playtool.com/pages/psuconnectors/connectors.html

An cheaper old-spec PSU tester may meet your current needs, but keep in mind that to "future-proof" you may want to consider spending a bit more to get a tester that handles all the connectors on the newer PSUs.


http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/68988/#513510
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/62086/#446943
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-detai...No=1647108
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&...ageSize=50

edit to add:
also, read the user feedback/reviews for a specific item before making a purchase. If the website doesn't provide any customer feedback, look at other websites.

Martin Clark Nov 20, 2011, 06:46pm EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Power Supply Issues?
Thanks for your reply.

I am currently looking for another ATX PSU on ebay. Something better and more powerful hopefully this time.

It seems very strange that the original PSU lasted for years. and the replacement lasted for a month. It was a brand new unit. Maybe it was rubbish. When I first installed it, I did check the BIOS hardware monitor to see if the voltages were ok, and none of them was in the red. Since these seemed to be ok, I didn't bother to check again. This may have been a mistake.

SuPeR Xp Nov 27, 2011, 11:02am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Power Supply Issues?
Martin Clark said:
Thanks for your reply.

I am currently looking for another ATX PSU on ebay. Something better and more powerful hopefully this time.

It seems very strange that the original PSU lasted for years. and the replacement lasted for a month. It was a brand new unit. Maybe it was rubbish. When I first installed it, I did check the BIOS hardware monitor to see if the voltages were ok, and none of them was in the red. Since these seemed to be ok, I didn't bother to check again. This may have been a mistake.

If you recieved a replacement, most likely that replacement was a refurbished power supply. Most if not all companies such as ASUS, Gigabyte, Enermax, OCZ, Corsair etc., all will either send you a brand new Power Supply via warranty or a Re-Furbished (Like New) as per the warranty's fine print. I find this happening with Hard Drives, RAMs, Motherboards and so on. It sucks and not fair to us the consumers.

-------------------------------------------------
Custom AMD HAF 932 Red Dragon GAMING MOD!!!
http://www.techpowerup.com/gallery/2442.html
Martin Clark Nov 29, 2011, 05:58am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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Edited: Nov 29, 2011, 06:00am EST

 
>> Re: Power Supply Issues?
If that is what's happening then I agree that does suck. I wondered if the unit was one of those power supplys that has 300W or whatever in it's name, but was actually a 100W unit. I am still looking for a replacement unit on Ebay. Would welcome any suggestions for a good make/model to look out for it needs to have 4 x molex. 1 x berg. and 20pin motherboard connector with a 4 pin P4 connector. I am looking for a standard ATX PSU. I notice on Ebay, some sellers can't be arsed to even list the connectors so you don't know what you are bidding on.

john albrich Nov 29, 2011, 10:04am EST Reply - Quote - Report Abuse
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>> Re: Power Supply Issues?
.
Keep in mind that some product pages show pictures that are "representative' of a PSU, but NOT necessarily the specific item being offered for sale. Watch out for the fine print.

As for PSU specifications, if you can obtain the UL registration number (non-counterfeit, of course) you can check the details out as discussed in my post at:
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/75631/#573346


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