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  ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!! 
 
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Supreet Virdi Jan 29, 2008, 06:57pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
Words like "smashes" and "utterly bashes" clearly tells your intention and what you are upto. You don't have to say the same thing over and over and over and over and over again. We got your point, but the thing is 3870X2 is "cheaper" and is a "single" card with "single" PCB -- minus all the hassles for CrossFire/SLI.

And the most important thing, drivers are not fully matured for it. You can't expect miracles to happen with the first set of drivers for a new video card, certainly it takes time. Besides you get better playback/decode engine with ATI card, and DX 10.1.

Its a damn good card for the price it offers. $449 is outstanding for a brand new card. Besides the best HD 3870 X2 to get is one from MSI as it uses Copper HSF and is faster than other counterparts.

ATI is a new king of the hill for a moment, take it and get on with your life.


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vulcan raven Jan 29, 2008, 07:13pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
Supreet Virdi said:
Words like "smashes" and "utterly bashes" clearly tells your intention and what you are upto. You don't have to say the same thing over and over and over and over and over again. We got your point, but the thing is 3870X2 is "cheaper" and is a "single" card with "single" PCB -- minus all the hassles for CrossFire/SLI.

And the most important thing, drivers are not fully matured for it. You can't expect miracles to happen with the first set of drivers for a new video card, certainly it takes time. Besides you get better playback/decode engine with ATI card, and DX 10.1.

Its a damn good card for the price it offers. $449 is outstanding for a brand new card. Besides the best HD 3870 X2 to get is one from MSI as it uses Copper HSF and is faster than other counterparts.

ATI is a new king of the hill for a moment, take it and get on with your life.



i really think you read into things faaaaaaaaaar too much lol. drivers will be important, but i think that its performance is generally about what you would expect - its the same as crossfire 3870. i really know you didnt read all the points i made, it has some advantages of being on a single PCB, but others that i pointed out where the card isnt configurable like SLI and crossfire is.

it might be cheaper in north america. but it isnt cheaper here, or most other regions. i think that some people in north america really believe thats the only market components are sold in :/

theres no point going over it all again, but 10.1 gives you nothing useful and video playback is hardly a concern when people pair these things with quad core processors lol

i guess if you want two of them in crossfire, they would be interesting until we see 9800 GX2 tests. but if you have a crossfire/sli board as a huge amount of people now do, it would be wise to look at other solutions rather than a single X2.

--------------------ANTEC cased rig--------------------
http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7362136
Beavis Khan Jan 29, 2008, 07:14pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
Obvious agenda or not, Vulcan does have a point. Innovative is great, but at the end of the day most gamers care about price vs. performance.

How come no one is doing reviews with 2 x 3870X2? Or is this not possible yet? I think that's really the most interesting possibility for this card. Or hell, why not 4 of them? I seem to remember a recent ATI tech demo with 4 x 3800 series cards in Crossfire. The X2 has low enough power consumption that it wouldn't even be totally ridiculous. If ATI could be the first to figure out how to parallelize across GPUs in a general manner (as opposed to using game-specific driver tricks, as both ATI and Nvidia do now), it would be an opportunity to take a huge lead in high end graphics. But even with clumsy drivers, I'd love to see what an 8 GPU system could do. (insert your Crysis jokes here :) )

____
"For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong."

- H.L. Mencken
vulcan raven Jan 29, 2008, 07:19pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
Big Beavis said:
Obvious agenda or not, Vulcan does have a point. Innovative is great, but at the end of the day most gamers care about price vs. performance.

How come no one is doing reviews with 2 x 3870X2? Or is this not possible yet? I think that's really the most interesting possibility for this card. Or hell, why not 4 of them? I seem to remember a recent ATI tech demo with 4 x 3800 series cards in Crossfire. The X2 has low enough power consumption that it wouldn't even be totally ridiculous. If ATI could be the first to figure out how to parallelize across GPUs in a general manner (as opposed to using game-specific driver tricks, as both ATI and Nvidia do now), it would be an opportunity to take a huge lead in high end graphics. But even with clumsy drivers, I'd love to see what an 8 GPU system could do. (insert your Crysis jokes here :) )


the scaling will surely drop off the more GPUs you add. i mean in crysis with 3 ultras, they managed 2.5. not bad. but i suspect as soon as you add four or more the whole ratio will come crashing down. its not like CPU scaling, where you get very high scaling efficiency as long as you have enough cache, for example the 8 core intel systems had like scaling of 7.9.

--------------------ANTEC cased rig--------------------
http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7362136
Shadow_Ops_Airman1 Jan 29, 2008, 07:23pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
well its obvious that Crysis is a CPU game more than a GPU cause someone overclocked and it actually benefited from it over at TPU that is.

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vulcan raven Jan 29, 2008, 07:31pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
Shadow_Ops_Airman1 said:
well its obvious that Crysis is a CPU game more than a GPU cause someone overclocked and it actually benefited from it over at TPU that is.


you sure? i wouldnt have thought crysis is CPU limited at all. more the other way around. if its a slow CPU then you are gonna get GPU bottlenecking. but i have seen a few tests where increasing CPU speed doesnt affect the game hardly at all.

--------------------ANTEC cased rig--------------------
http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7362136
Supreet Virdi Jan 29, 2008, 07:37pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
i really think you read into things faaaaaaaaaar too much lol. drivers will be important, but i think that its performance is generally about what you would expect - its the same as crossfire 3870


- It is not, it is better in most benchmarks, HD 3870X2 takes the lead over HD 3870's in CrossFire, even the two GPUs are on single PCB, yet is so beautifully created that the efficiency is upto 95%. Yet, I would still go with single HD 3870X2 for obvious reason, it is a 'one' single card.

i really know you didnt read all the points i made, it has some advantages of being on a single PCB, but others that i pointed out where the card isnt configurable like SLI and crossfire is.


- I read your invalid points. Yes, I did.. completely. If you're saying a single HD 3870X2 can beat CrossFire HD 3870, and yet it is not 'configurable' (don't know what you meant) like SLI and CrossFire then 'please' explain. From efficiency perspective, from performance perspective, from scaling perspective and from air-ventilation HD 3870X2 leads without a doubt. Yet, please expand your statement -- 'configurable like SLI or CrossFire'



it might be cheaper in north america. but it isnt cheaper here, or most other regions. i think that some people in north america really believe thats the only market components are sold in :/


- Errrrr...so that probably goes from all video cards, including NVIDIA cards. Computer products and components are generally easily available and are more cheaper in America than anywhere else on the earth!

theres no point going over it all again, but 10.1 gives you nothing useful and video playback is hardly a concern when people pair these things with quad core processors lol


- Its only you who think DX 10.1 is uselss, or gives nothing useful. Once it is shipped with Vista SP1 and once games are being made using DX 10.1, it will lot more usefull, especially for game developers to code it correctly. It supports FP32 FILTERING, and not to mentioned enhanced Anti-Aliasing [free 4xMSAA] and HDR lighting. (!)

- It may not be useful for you in "Playback/Decode" section, for me and other people it may be useful, in other words, ATI has advantage in this section (!)


i guess if you want two of them in crossfire, they would be interesting until we see 9800 GX2 tests.


- 9800GX2 would be faster, as the NVIDIA Architecture scales better with current generation of games, but it would be interesting to see how 3870X2 competes 9800GX2, we'll wait and see.

but if you have a crossfire/sli board as a huge amount of people now do, it would be wise to look at other solutions rather than a single X2.


- One HD 3870X2 > CrossFire HD 3870.. nuff said!

Supreet Virdi Jan 29, 2008, 07:45pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!

Supreet Virdi Jan 29, 2008, 07:50pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
vulcan raven said:

the scaling will surely drop off the more GPUs you add. i mean in crysis with 3 ultras, they managed 2.5. not bad. but i suspect as soon as you add four or more the whole ratio will come crashing down. its not like CPU scaling, where you get very high scaling efficiency as long as you have enough cache, for example the 8 core intel systems had like scaling of 7.9.


- More GPUs in Parallel either on a board or in SLI/CrossFire will decrease efficiency, as they need to work a lot in parallel while executing instructions. The best way to maintain efficiency is to keep researching for a better route on how the GPUs would communicate to each other and yet maintain good results. It can never be 100%.

vulcan raven Jan 29, 2008, 07:50pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
it isnt significantly faster than crossfire 3870. i have seen tens of benches now, and except for one extremely anomalous test, they are extremely close. incredibly close, they both win some and lose some, but always very closely within a couple frames that it doesnt appear to matter what you have. besides, its still a dodgy technology as i pointed out. some tests might indicate that there is a difference, most others say there isnt.

as for configurable, im talking about such things as splitting frames. the X2 selects AFR mode and you cant change it. games performance can break when certain load splitting modes are enabled, with the X2 you cannot alter the mode AFR is all well and nice, but it doesnt work all the time, every time. its perfect for synthetic benches too incidentally, but less useful in the real world when its constantly enabled!! how exactly can you say my points are invalid, when you dont even understand them????

so you admit the market is not only narrow on this card, its narrowed further by being financially viable only in selective regions? lol. great.

nvidia dont support 10.1 understand this: if nvidia dont support it, hardly anyone will use it properly. just the way it is. lets not get into that, i said it, 10.1 isnt going to be much use for anyone anytime soon on an operating system no one has. it wont proliferate enough for it to make a difference to people buying these cards soon enough, as long as they have the knowledge to understand that anyway.

who buys one of these for video decoding? lol. nuff said. its a gaming part.finally, im sorry, but this card is not significantly faster than crossfire 3870. some of the X2's are overclcoked, and tested against standard 3870's in crossfire, hence they may have slightly higher in game scores. for obvious reasons. :_)

try these for crossfire v X2

http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=11398&page=6

http://www.presence-pc.com/tests/ATI-HD-3870-X2-22752/14/

finally and most useful this: http://www.tweaktown.com/articles/1282/14

its a comparison. accounting for driver specific tweaks, the X2 is not really faster significantly than crossfire. about 1-2 frames increase. thats so small a margin of error accounting for chipsets and drivers, the X2 cannot be significantly faster, all of the time. it isnt like 10 percent faster or anything major like that. the tweaktown conclusion is interesting. its basically what i have been saying.

--------------------ANTEC cased rig--------------------
http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7362136
Supreet Virdi Jan 29, 2008, 08:13pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
vulcan raven said:
it isnt significantly faster than crossfire 3870. i have seen tens of benches now, and except for one extremely anomalous test, they are extremely close. incredibly close, they both win some and lose some, but always very closely within a couple frames that it doesnt appear to matter what you have.


Isn't "significantly" better than CrossFire 3870? Sorry, that wasn't in question at all, it IS better HD 3870 X2, and that what matters most. It is faster, and better, means they've done very good job in incorporating two GPUs in a single board, and yet is 'faster'


as for configurable, im talking about such things as splitting frames. the X2 selects AFR mode and you cant change it. games performance can break when certain load splitting modes are enabled, with the X2 you cannot alter the mode AFR is all well and nice, but it doesnt work all the time, every time. its perfect for synthetic benches too incidentally, but less useful in the real world when its constantly enabled!!


- AFR mode is well know and is best mode available. I've used X850XT CrossFire, I know better than YOU how these mode works in game, I never bother to even change these rendering modes, because I always played games with AFR and it works 100% fine in all games. Super-AA is a mode with problems with some games, but even it is working with all the games now.

how exactly can you say my points are invalid, when you dont even understand them????


- Your points are not only invalid, but baseless too. If you're talking about ATI and ATI Video Cards, you messed with the correct person (!)

so you admit the market is not only narrow on this card, its narrowed further by being financially viable only in selective regions? lol. great.


- For all products, its goes the same, that includes NVIDIA and 8800-Series.


nvidia dont support 10.1 understand this: if nvidia dont support it, hardly anyone will use it properly.


- Why? and why do you think if a game is developed on DX 10.1 it won't be used on NVIDIA hardware with DX10 implementation? Besides, developers give a crap about it, they want their work done in more precise way. FP 32 Filtering would certainly enhance image quality so why not use it?

just the way it is. lets not get into that, i said it, 10.1 isnt going to be much use for anyone anytime soon on an operating system no one has. it wont proliferate enough for it to make a difference to people buying these cards soon enough, as long as they have the knowledge to understand that anyway.


- Lets get and get into it only. SP1 on Vista contain DX10.1, and yes developers will use it i'm afraid.


who buys one of these for video decoding? lol. nuff said. its a gaming part.finally, im sorry, but this card is not significantly faster than crossfire 3870. some of the X2's are overclcoked, and tested against standard 3870's in crossfire, hence they may have slightly higher in game scores. for obvious reasons. :_)


- If you don't buy for Video decoding/Playback, do you expect other won't? How naive. Although, nice edit in the end. Take a look Tomshardware benchmark again, they've used Standard (ATI-ES) HD 3870X2, and yet it wins most test compared to HD 3870 CrossFire........for obvious reasons :_)

Supreet Virdi Jan 29, 2008, 08:16pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
vulcan raven said:


try these for crossfire v X2

http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=11398&page=6

http://www.presence-pc.com/tests/ATI-HD-3870-X2-22752/14/

finally and most useful this: http://www.tweaktown.com/articles/1282/14

its a comparison. accounting for driver specific tweaks, the X2 is not really faster than crossfire. about 1-2 frames increase. thats so small a margin of error accounting for chipsets and drivers, the X2 cannot be significantly faster, all of the time. it isnt like 10 percent faster or anything major like that. the tweaktown conclusion is interesting. its basically what i have been saying.


- I give a damn ands**t about those benchmarks, faster or not, HD 3870X2 is a better implementation of two GPUs on a single board and yet it is cheap more reliable and easy to use, and yet cheaper.

Don't edit your post often, instead, first think and then execute your words. That would be lot more sensible thing to do.

vulcan raven Jan 29, 2008, 08:23pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
there is little point continuing this. i have the links to show that X2 is NOT significantly faster than crossfire.

there is so little point arguing about 10.1, when the circumstances for use are slim again. the Os isnt out, the games arent therefore supporting it, nvidias 'the way' program is implemented on a huge amount of games, by the time everything is out and working on 10.1 the next generation of cards will be out so its a totally insignificant advantage.

X1k series could do HDR AND FSAA. geforce 7 couldnt. practically zero games at the time could do both in their engines anyway.by the time a few good games supported both, the cards cant handle both anyway. useless. pointless feature at the time then. same thing as this 10.1 malarkey. besides, DX10 doesnt even work properly and the hardware isnt fast enough for it. what chance has the update got?


my points are valid. you just wont accept that having a configurable setup is superior any which way. the thing about all products makes no sense. this card is in a certain situation where its financially viable more in NA. you are telling me you buy a 300 pound card for video decoding? no. you dont. you buy it for gaming, and video decoding is a minor minor bonus if you have a modern dual core, which you will, if you have bought one of these suckers.

and finally, tweaktown have shown and come to the same conclusion as me.

nuff said, case closed.

EDIT: p.s i had to edit, because you replied to yourself three times in a row haha :P

rather that than going on a post frenzy

--------------------ANTEC cased rig--------------------
http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7362136
Supreet Virdi Jan 29, 2008, 08:37pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
vulcan raven said:
there is little point continuing this. i have the links to show that X2 is NOT significantly faster than crossfire.


- I never said HD 3870X2 is "significantly" faster than HD 3870 CrossFire, I've said it is better than HD CrossFire HD 3870. I'm implying on a fact, that it is cheaper, efficient & reliable approach. I'm still shocked to see how efficient HD 3870X2 is and what a great job they've done.

there is so little point arguing about 10.1, when the circumstances for use are slim again. the Os isnt out, the games arent therefore supporting it, nvidias 'the way' program is implemented on a huge amount of games, by the time everything is out and working on 10.1 the next generation of cards will be out so its a totally insignificant advantage.


- Wait a second? I asked you the same in my previous post. If a game developer develops a game in DX10.1, why it won't run with NVIDIA hardware and how it will affect NVIDIA's 'the way' craptisement?

X1k series could do HDR AND FSAA. geforce 7 couldnt. practically zero games at the time could do both in their engines anyway. pointless feature at the time then. same thing as this 10.1 malarkey.


- X1900XTX was sufficient to play Oblivion and other games with the feature at playable FPS and at high resolution with all eye-candy.


my points are valid. you just wont accept that having a configurable setup is superior any which way.


....


the thing about all products makes no sense. this card is in a certain situation where its financially viable more in NA. you are telling me you buy a 300 pound card for video decoding?


- When did I say to purchase this card for Video Decoding/Playback reasons? No its a wonderful gaming card that supports great features for so cheap.

no. you dont. you buy it for gaming, and video decoding is a minor minor bonus if you have a modern dual core, which you will, if you have bought one of these suckers.


- Don't know from where are you getting it. I'm referring to full decode support for both VC-1 and H.264. MPEG-2, and it does it brilliantly, not to mention playback quality is awesome.

Scumbag Blues Jan 29, 2008, 08:41pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
vulcan raven said:
there is little point continuing this. i have the links to show that X2 is NOT significantly faster than crossfire.

there is so little point arguing about 10.1, when the circumstances for use are slim again. the Os isnt out, the games arent therefore supporting it, nvidias 'the way' program is implemented on a huge amount of games, by the time everything is out and working on 10.1 the next generation of cards will be out so its a totally insignificant advantage.

X1k series could do HDR AND FSAA. geforce 7 couldnt. practically zero games at the time could do both in their engines anyway. pointless feature at the time then. same thing as this 10.1 malarkey.

my points are valid. you just wont accept that having a configurable setup is superior any which way. the thing about all products makes no sense. this card is in a certain situation where its financially viable more in NA. you are telling me you buy a 300 pound card for video decoding? no. you dont. you buy it for gaming, and video decoding is a minor minor bonus if you have a modern dual core, which you will, if you have bought one of these suckers.

and finally, tweaktown have shown and come to the same conclusion as me.

nuff said, case closed.

EDIT: p.s i had to edit, because you replied to yourself three times in a row haha :P

rather that than going on a post frenzy


Well first, I think you may have misunderstood Supreet Virdi. Supreet is stating that the HD3870X2 is better than two HD3870's in Crossfire and not saying that the HD3870X2 is significantly better than two HD3870's in Crossfire.

Secondly, I don't think DX10.1 would be completely useless. It is difficult to judge how well it would work and how well it would be implemented considering that it isn't even implemented yet. Additionally, you can't say that it is useless because it isn't even out yet, and therefore, no one is working with it, and therefore is useless. That form of argument makes no logical sense. Using that logic, I could say the 9800GX2 will flop since it isn't out yet and therefore no one has used it. It's confusing to say the least.

Thirdly, you don't buy a card like the HD3870X2 for its "ability to be configurable". However, the same goes for Crossfire. You require two or more cards to be able to use Crossfire (of course including the necessary motherboard). That isn't any more "configurable" than the HD3870X2 since you have to replace both cards in order to "upgrade". Crossfire is limited in terms of mixing and matching and there would be no point anyway even if you could with cards from different generations. Matching a nextgen card with a lastgen card would be pointless. At least with the HD3870X2, there's only one card that needs to be replaced.

Fourthly, if you really wanted to buy a card for video decoding and playback, the best solution would be a workstation card. However, that is if you are solely working with video decoding and playback. If you want to be able to work with other graphical applications like gaming, this card would suit well. It really depends on the user so stating a particular feature of a card is useless is entirely based on the user.

Lastly, what's wrong with editing so many times? I often edit my posts many times to clear up spelling and grammar mistakes, structure, ordering, etc. I don't see how this is a credible claim in a debate. I don't even see this as a way of insulting someone's intelligence. And last time I checked, you're supposed to keep thats**t under control.

~

Intel i7 2600K @ 4.4GHz | Gigabyte P67A-UD4 | G.Skill Ripjaws DDR3-1600 4GB | XFX Radeon HD 6950
vulcan raven Jan 29, 2008, 08:50pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!

--------------------ANTEC cased rig--------------------
http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7362136
Supreet Virdi Jan 29, 2008, 09:00pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!

Scumbag Blues Jan 29, 2008, 09:04pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!

~

Intel i7 2600K @ 4.4GHz | Gigabyte P67A-UD4 | G.Skill Ripjaws DDR3-1600 4GB | XFX Radeon HD 6950
vulcan raven Jan 29, 2008, 09:18pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!
its only cheaper in certain limited regions. its not more reliable. theres no proof lol dont make stuff up like that for fun.

i read all about DX10.1, and as it goes, im inclined to listen to yerli, only the guy who has created the most cutting edge game currently in existence rather than you. im funny that way. :P

now for the patch. i pointed out that it was poor, because of the performance.

try this: http://www.elitebastards.com/cms/index.php?option=com_content&...mitstart=3

outdoor performance? HDR plus 4x FSAA, piddling 12 x 9 res, minimum framerate? 15. average? 23. ummmm. yeah. good stuff there from a vital feature. 15 freaking frame minimum. its a comparison i struck because at the time, it was touted as a major thing ati support and nvidia didnt, but it was a feature before its time, and was never really viable because of that. sound familiar?

turns out that considering the circumstances we are in with Dx10 already, having 10.1 in the ati architecture is on the same level of usefulness, in that it isnt useful now, wont be in the near future on this level of hardware by the looks of it, only works on OS version A and with game B which you have to put together with hardware C to enable in the year X hahaha:P in other words, its not sensible a reason to buy the card on its own right now. i mean three ultras crying out loud cant run crysis maxed in DX10 now. unless 10.1 improves the efficiency of the rendering path by about 200 percent, its not going to impact the industry with more than a butterfly landing on mount rushmore.

the video decode feature as i pointed out, is not a big deal. you know that too. ;) what you said changes that? no lol, just like i said, where are the 2900XT owners moaning that their performance gaming card doesnt have as good video decoding as a 2600? find me a geforce 88 owner who is moaning about video decoding

--------------------ANTEC cased rig--------------------
http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7362136
Shadow_Ops_Airman1 Jan 29, 2008, 09:49pm EST Report Abuse
>> Re: ATI Radeon HD 3870X2 1 GB!!! this thing is a BEAST!!!

AMD Athlon XP-M 2500+ (133x14= 1867MHz) (209x11= 2299MHz)
DFI LP NF2 Ultra-B (Hellfire 3EG Rev2)
Antec SX800, Neo HE 500, 4 Antec 8CM Fans
Thermalright SI-97 1 Antec Tricool 12CM Fan
CL SB XFi Xtreme Music
2x Barracuda HDs (250/400)
2x Samsung Write

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